Precious Metals Forum

Go Back   Precious Metals Forum > Bunker Talk > BSTS

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-24-2012, 12:10 PM   #1
Fly on the wall
 
h4rdware's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: little britain
Posts: 94
Liked: 39 times
...
BTW a few incidental stories about silver that some of you may not know about already...

During a trip to Russia in 2000, I visited a small rural village where I was at some point shown a huge shiny metal container in the forest, built to hold water. It was owned by the local orthodox church. I was told they kept 'holy water' in there for the church. But the details are interesting - they produced this 'holy water' by throwing a pure silver cross into the container and leaving it there. It had to be silver. Now that sounds like a classic belief system, but I made a mental note. A good scientist learns not to ignore 'old knowledge' because even the most unlikely behaviour can hide practical facts, esp if it survives many generations.

The second story is kind of similar, but even more interesting. A recipie from a (once again Russian) cookbook, dating from the mid 1700's describes an interesting way to make an unusual dairy product - kind of like yoghurt but not really yoghurt. It involves fermenting milk in a container with a pure silver coin placed at the bottom. If you use any other kind of coin (or forget to use the coin) the milk turns bad, fermentation goes somewhat offcourse, and the recipie doesn't work.

Third story - I recently found out that for many years, silver nitrate was dropped into the eyes of new babies to prevent/kill infections carried from the mother. It was dangerous if carelessly overdoesed, but was otherwise highly effective. This practice stopped when antibiotics were developed, effectively replacing it.

Conclusion: Silver is a powerful biocide. It has been used throughout history to fend off infection and spoiled food and water. But you won't find much more than footnotes, if anything, in modern medicine and especially food production literature. It may never recover such use (unless ABs run out of rope, but pharmas will always be waiting to offer something else), but it does show just how immensely useful this stuff is....

Last edited by PMBug; 01-25-2012 at 06:23 PM. Reason: This post split off from another thread
h4rdware is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2012, 06:46 AM   #2
Ground Beetle
 
bushi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 971
Liked: 554 times
Originally Posted by h4rdware View Post:
Conclusion: Silver is a powerful biocide.
Correct. Both silver, and gold ions are highly toxic to many bacteria (AFAIK, they damage their cell walls). This is very cool in modern applications - you can produce permanently anti-bacterial materials this way. Examples:
  • plastics used inside some of the refrigerators (added/coated with silver ions) - prevents bacteria that would otherwise grow on tiny spots of food/splashes of fluid from meat etc. Effective for the lifetime of the fridge, without using any aggressive chemical agents
  • fibers used to produce socks, that will not smell badly, and will keep your feet in a nice, low-bacteria, anti-fungus environment. And it also lasts for the lifetime of the product, withstands washing (but why should you wash them, if they do not smell badly )
  • it is one of the old superstitions in my homeland, when someone suffers from stye (nasty eye infection), to rub it a bit with wedding ring. I was surprised to learn later in life, that gold ions are powerful antibacterial agents. And you know, wedding rings, gold - I've made the connection

There's also all that tin-hat/crackpot movement (getting more & more sympathetic to all of them weirdos, seems that they were right on many things, even if by chance!), regarding supposed health benefits of ingesting colloidal silver. I've never spared it too much thought, but I know it can be dangerous (as any heavy metal, silver might accumulate in your body, and could reach levels that would be toxic). But they might be on to something

cheers
bushi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2012, 02:43 PM   #3
Fly on the wall
 
h4rdware's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: little britain
Posts: 94
Liked: 39 times
bushi - thanks for adding your own knowledge to the topic!

Yes indeed - my biggest concern with colloidal silver, is not the usefulness (yes maybe those guys were right?!) but rather, what ELSE might be in the silver.

Ultra high purity silver is one thing, but if it's 'only' .999 then you have .001 of something else. And if that's lead, mercury, cadmium or worse then things aren't so great. You would probably get away with it for a long time, but I'd definitely want to know for sure what the .001% was before taking it.

I know some people have been buying .999 Silver wire or other stuff and make their own colloidal brew. Sometimes this even involves tapwater (electrolysed tapwater - good grief).

So I like the independent spirit, but the execution is probably far from ideal...

OTOH I'm not for regulation either, because it kills off 'old knowledge' like this very effectively, and replaces it with something expensive and intellectually 'owned' which ultimately translates into parasitic dependence. Better that people can do what they choose, while encouraging the wisdom to do it safely or at least understanding the risks.
h4rdware is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2012, 03:32 PM   #4
Yellow Jacket
 
ancona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Waaay south
Posts: 3,370
Liked: 2046 times
Bushi and H4,
Colloidal silver can be very beneficial, but the purity of the silver used to make it needs to be extremely high. Canadian Maple Leafs are .9999 or better, so i would think them to be pure enough. You have to be careful though, because as H4 said, it can and will accumulate in the body, and can cause a permanent condition called Agyria, which turns your flesh blue. Not just a small part.....your whole body.

Now I have to say that I always did want to make it with that blue chick in Star Trek......but I don't know how I would feel about turning blue myself.
__________________
All things being equal, the simplest answer is quite often the correct answer - Occam
ancona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2012, 03:34 PM   #5
Yellow Jacket
 
DCFusor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Floyd, Virginia
Posts: 1,682
Liked: 1233 times
Well, the stuff will turn you blue: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argyria

They seem to be saying that the popular medicinal use is not effective as silver isn't delivered in the correct ionic state to the body - we don't have nitric acid in our gut to dissolve the metal effectively. I know I got some prescription silver based cream that is very loud about stating external use only.

Anything anti microbial is subject to the same caveat - continued use of it at low levels encourages evolution of things resistant to it. So it's a cure, not a prophylactic in best use.
DCFusor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2012, 04:11 PM   #6
Yellow Jacket
 
ancona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Waaay south
Posts: 3,370
Liked: 2046 times
DC,
Not to hijack.....but I went to your site......and probably cannot offer much in the way of intelligent conversation, so I will simply lurk. You guys go in to some crazy difficult shit, and my world is more about civil engineering, so ......well......I'll just lurk for now. ;-)
__________________
All things being equal, the simplest answer is quite often the correct answer - Occam
ancona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2012, 04:31 PM   #7
Predaceous stink bug
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 110
Liked: 54 times
Originally Posted by DCFusor View Post:
Well, the stuff will turn you blue: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argyria

They seem to be saying that the popular medicinal use is not effective as silver isn't delivered in the correct ionic state to the body - we don't have nitric acid in our gut to dissolve the metal effectively. I know I got some prescription silver based cream that is very loud about stating external use only.

Anything anti microbial is subject to the same caveat - continued use of it at low levels encourages evolution of things resistant to it. So it's a cure, not a prophylactic in best use.
Micron size is most important.
Evolution of resistance to colloidal silver is another pharmaceutical fear leveraging act.
Its charge is its weapon, your weapon
Look to see just how many new medical uses of silver are being AMA recognized. Sadly, after patents are filed and process is deemed dangerous for commoners- AS PLANNED.
Buy or make colloidal silver(in distilled water) with appropriate equipment <$200.
Place drops upon bandage and cover scape or cut. Replace once per day.
Watch faster, less scarring, healing of the wound.
...AMA Obtundia, Neosporen etc actually strangle or smother would. No oxygen, no bacteria, no life. This is counterproductive. Petroleum wound ointments are bacteria laden in less than 4 hours....
Have a food poisoning upset stomach?
Take a tablespoon and wait :45min.
Have developing sore throat, gargle.
Flu or colds pervasive in your area, take 10 drops a day.
Why was "one born with a silver spoon in their mouths" and lived?
Micron size is the most important. If particles are to large they will lodge in the body, turning one blue.
One does not need to dissolve the silver.
Do not consume silver "mud" on the bottom of container. This is not colloidal, it is a precipitate.
Buying high quality colloidal silver machine; precipitate is absent or minimal.

"external use only" in your ointment, is due to what the silver is suspended in.
drAGonfly47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2012, 12:43 PM   #8
Ground Beetle
 
bushi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 971
Liked: 554 times
...also just recalled, there are commercially available band-aids and pads with "nano-silver" AFAIR, (or again silver ions, can't remember for sure), used for healing ulcers and other infected stuff that difficult to heal otherwise, and/or broadly antibiotic-resistant. I remember reading article few years ago in some popular science mag (NewScientist???), regarding the research and it's very good results in such applications, as well as helping healing 3rd degree burns (hard to heal on its own, very prone to infections and tissue asphyxia (? dead tissue, not sure about the proper translation to Englese ))

Reading drAGonfly47's comment rung the bell for me! So definitely, there is something going on here.

But since passing new drug through the whole cycle with the final FDA approval costs roughly $1bn, it is no wonder that the only things that we can get from the drug corps are very expensive drugs that can be patented. They can hardly obtain a patent for a silver, so what sane business would spend a round $1bn just to get something to be approved to market, if anyone could get it for 30 quid/OZ afterwards

Well, just another case for the free market and personal & economic freedom, I guess...

Last edited by bushi; 01-26-2012 at 12:46 PM.
bushi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2012, 02:03 PM   #9
Yellow Jacket
 
DCFusor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Floyd, Virginia
Posts: 1,682
Liked: 1233 times
Quote :
Evolution of resistance to colloidal silver is another pharmaceutical fear leveraging act.
It might also be that, but hey - this is science, and law and politics really don't affect the actual results much if at all.

Actually, I don't see *any* lobbying by the pharma industry to reduce the use of any of the antibiotics they sell (including silver-based ones like the one on my end-table right this instant) because of this. They DID patent (or get regulatory approval for) the use of particular silver formulations.

DCFusor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2012, 02:11 PM   #10
Yellow Jacket
 
ancona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Waaay south
Posts: 3,370
Liked: 2046 times
That's soem great stuff DC. I have a big jar of it myself. It works on any topical problem you have including fungus. I love the stuff. I also often wondered why colloids weren't used in nebulizers for pneumonia patients. It seems to me that it would begin to work nearly immediately, and that after a half dozen treatments, the pneumonia would be sufficiently killed off that ones body could finish the job, and earn a resistance to teh damn thing.
__________________
All things being equal, the simplest answer is quite often the correct answer - Occam
ancona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2012, 02:22 PM   #11
Yellow Jacket
 
DCFusor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Floyd, Virginia
Posts: 1,682
Liked: 1233 times
FWIW - doesn't work on MRSA worth a darn.
Good on most other things, as you say.
DCFusor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2012, 09:28 PM   #12
Predaceous stink bug
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 110
Liked: 54 times
Originally Posted by DCFusor View Post:
FWIW - doesn't work on MRSA worth a darn.
Good on most other things, as you say.

@ 4:48 this quoted study begs to differ, and is not alone.


The Pharma owned AMA will do everything they are told to do, or to NOT do.

Look beyond trained MSM.
drAGonfly47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 09:08 AM   #13
Yellow Jacket
 
ancona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Waaay south
Posts: 3,370
Liked: 2046 times
"The Pharma owned AMA will do everything they are told to do, or to NOT do.

Look beyond trained MSM. "


I agree 100%. The pharmaceutical industry does not want any diseases cured, and will go to great lengths to outlaw anything that may prove beneficial that they do not have an absolute lock on. This includes silver. Big Pharma has no control over colloidal silver, so they will do their best to demonize it, and even go as far as to try and outlaw it.
__________________
All things being equal, the simplest answer is quite often the correct answer - Occam
ancona is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:44 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® from Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Content of PMBug.com copyright © 2011 - 2019 Measuring Up. All Rights Reserved.