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Old 02-27-2014, 12:03 PM   #1
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Living off grid ruled illegal in FL

Crazy.

http://www.offthegridnews.com/2014/0...ng-is-illegal/
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Old 02-27-2014, 01:52 PM   #2
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We need to place this article in proper context. This lady lives in a pretty tony area right now, but wants to have water barrels holding rainwater for her water supply, chickens in the yard, etc. I am all for off-grid lifestyles, and I'm pretty much on the "my property is my own business" bandwagon, but a high end neighborhood is probably not the place to make a stand.

If I move in to a neighborhood with tree lined streets and manicured lawns, then bought a 350,000 dollar house, I would not want to look at that stuff either. I think that the effect on the property values of others around her might trump out her right to do pretty much as she pleases.

In addition, the house in the article you linked to is not her house, it's a stock photo. They didn't explain about the multiple barrels on the side of her house or the empty ones laying about in the yard. Nor did they speak about her cowboy installation of other off-grid measures. Cape Coral is a very nice area, and in a hurricane, all that shit will be ripped from her house and thrown in to others.

Just my two cents.
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Old 02-28-2014, 06:24 AM   #3
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I read on another forum that she is using the city sewage service, but not paying for it because the city doesn't charge for the sewage service - they charge for city water, which she isn't using.
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Old 02-28-2014, 06:38 AM   #4
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Is very crazy..

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Old 02-28-2014, 08:52 AM   #5
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Obviously the whole article could be a lie, but all I can go by is what the article says. From the article. (emphasis added)

"Special Magistrate Harold S. Eskin ruled that the city’s codes allow Robin Speronis to live without utility power but she is still required to hook her home to the city’s water system. Her alternative source of power must be approved by the city, Eskin said"

"Speronis has been fighting the city of Cape Coral since November when a code enforcement officer tried to evict her from her home for living without utilities. The city contends that Speronis violated the International Property Maintenance Code by relying on rain water instead of the city water system and solar panels instead of the electric grid."

No mention of chickens or the rain barrels being unsightly or anything just that the city isn't getting paid for water she isn't using in the 1st place.

"Part of the conflict: She must hook up to the water system, although officials acknowledge she does not have to use it."

"Speronis told Off The Grid News that she actually won on two of three counts, although she acknowledged her legal battle is far from over."

"Magistrate Admits Code is Unreasonable"

That would go without saying IMO. The govt. want to mandate recycling and a "green" lifestyle and reducing "carbon footprint" but if doing so means having an ugly rain barrel or especially losing tax/utility $$ then they need to fine and sue you into going back to your old lifestyle of no ugly rain barrels or recycling bins, start watering the lawn 2-3x a day, use lots of the city's gas & electricity etc. etc. I think the closer individuals get to not relying on the gubment, and especially if that self reliance means them getting less money from you, then you will see them start having more tantrums, especially at the state and local levels who don't have all the income sources as the feds.
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Old 03-01-2014, 11:18 AM   #6
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Well, we have a slightly different problem here, or a few of them. Friend Dave has all this going on in a nearby, restrictive town. He's hooked to the city water - but doesn't use it, or only uses a little, had to pay extra for a special meter for it. He keeps bees, chickens, an orchard, a garden, all on a couple acres (large plot for that suburban subdivision), and no one complains. Dave's a really nice guy, which helps. He pays mega-taxes due to where he is, and the rather obvious home/solar/rain collection, generally high value everything.

What's been happening in the 35 years or so since I moved here is far more insidious than what ancona describes - he and I agree on that.

But what if it's the reverse? In other words, here you are, a farmer, minding your own business, and someone builds a toney development nearby?
Versions of this have been happening over and over, killing farms and off grid types - I even had one guy complain about a shooting range I have that had been here *decades* before he bought land nearby, knowing it was there. A pig farm in a place I'd not even call a town (then or now) had to become a milk farm (far more work per dollar), then a "farm expo" that does no real farming, but has pumpkin festivals and car shows and so forth - not only did they get complaints from newcomers (you know the type - I wanna flip my house, so I'm going to get rid of you so my land value goes up), but since the toney stuff was near - their taxes went up, while their relative voter power went down. They had NO fault in all of this, other than not owning the entire county.

Even where I am, it's a bit borderline - it's getting too toney here too. I'm tolerated (and of course, everyone's backup when chips are down) as I've been here longer than anyone in the neighbourhood, do nice things for people, and am "colorful". And when the flipper who objected to my shooting range ran out of money - I bought his land for more insulation from jerks like that.

Funny thing - this started out with the entire neighborhood wanting this guy gone for various reasons, but the "toney types" couldn't raise 18 large between 5 of them (some of them after asking me how I live so poor) yet I just wrote a check...and these guys wanted to restrict how I could use that land. Well, I didn't agree to that, but of course, I only wanted it as insulation from the world, so it's nature preserve anyway. Useless for much else.

Funny old world, eh?
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Old 03-01-2014, 02:31 PM   #7
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That kind of stuff has gone on here too. When I worked at the state pen, there was also a minimum security facility that was still referred to as "the farm" as years ago the inmates raised crops there. This land was along the river and eventually many stupid people got the bright idea to build along the river and then got even more stupid by extending all the way up to the minimum security unit (paying the state top dollar for former prison farm land). Now there are hundreds of houses between the river and the minimum security unit, and they all bitch about the prison they built next to their houses! Now never mind that that the farm was there housing inmates before we were even a state, cause we don't want to cloud the issue with facts. I won't even get started with how they act and how much it costs us every time it floods down there.

Then there is the local gun club where they shoot trap and skeet only. We moved into a new housing development not too far from it when I was a kid and we could here them busting caps, but it never bothered our concerned us, as for one they would have been having to shoot high powered rifles to reach us, and we didn't live down range from the direction they were shooting either. Now 30+ years later there our houses built all they way around the property line of the gun club (including down range) and of course the people that live there are upset about them building a gun range so close to their house!

Revisionist history isn't exclusively practiced by politicians, reporters, or text book authors, but everyday ordinary people practice it with a vengeance. The fact that govt. agencies talk out both sides their mouth, or maybe I should say tax/fine both sides of the fence especially when it comes to practicing or not practicing the "green" lifestyle probably shouldn't be so surprising. Frustrating yes, surprising, unfortunately no.
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:43 PM   #8
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I always try to not be the worse house on the block.
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Old 03-02-2014, 06:27 PM   #9
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Depends on what you call the worst, Penn. I probably have the worst house in the neighborhood. Needs paint, not real pretty, I don't keep up my huge lawn, trees are among the weeds.

But then again, unlike my neighbors, I own it outright. Some of the ugly is indeed sustainable power, and water collection, I don't have to pay bills, and I have the coolest toys there are.

So what's worst? How it looks outside? Some of my ex-neighbors once asked me how I could live like this, and not own a mcMansion like they did. Well the bank owned their house then, and now owns it again, as it crumbles because banks are not very good at real estate, truth be told, and now I could ask them, if I ever saw them again - how could you live like that?

In other words, it ain't a simple question.
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Old 03-02-2014, 06:46 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by DCFusor View Post:
Depends on what you call the worst, Penn. I probably have the worst house in the neighborhood. Needs paint, not real pretty, I don't keep up my huge lawn, trees are among the weeds.

But then again, unlike my neighbors, I own it outright. Some of the ugly is indeed sustainable power, and water collection, I don't have to pay bills, and I have the coolest toys there are.

So what's worst? How it looks outside? Some of my ex-neighbors once asked me how I could live like this, and not own a mcMansion like they did. Well the bank owned their house then, and now owns it again, as it crumbles because banks are not very good at real estate, truth be told, and now I could ask them, if I ever saw them again - how could you live like that?

In other words, it ain't a simple question.
If I had mercury dime for every person who thinks having a lawn that looks like a football field is the height of success and/or happiness, I'd be able to stop buying PM's. out of my own pocket.
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