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Old 12-05-2011, 08:33 PM   #1
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Glock commercial

Enjoy.

Video did not embed; guess I did something wrong.

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Last edited by PMBug; 12-06-2011 at 06:16 AM. Reason: fixed URL so video would embed
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:16 PM   #2
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I LIKE it!
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:22 PM   #3
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Unobtanium, that was a great video! Thanks for posting it.

My Tai Chi instructor is a cop, he uses a .40 calber Glock. Glocks are supposed to VERY reliable (don´t jam, my Beretta 9 mm sometimes jams). If I get another handgun, it is likely to be a Glock, I would have to decide on which caliber.

Although I could make a case for myself that a Kimber .45 would be OK too...

EDIT:

I see that ancona has joined the ranks as a Supporter. Great choice of use of funds!
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:37 PM   #4
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Something very much like this actually happened in Arizona about a year ago. A guy trips over a cop car on the way in to rob a gun store. The people there described a scene very like this actually happening! It was like "who goes first on this turkey?". There really are perps that dumb out there. NRA had a field day reporting that one.

My CZ-97b in .45 ACP is the most reliable pistol I've ever owned (even with flying-ashtray hollow points), including Glocks, which I personally don't find a fit - which is not to say they're bad guns, they just don't fit me as well - you won't hear me dissing Glocks - from .40 up, they rock. I do like an explicit safety better. (ask Plaxico Burris about that one)
The CZ is more accurate for both me and friends who are Glock guys. But it's heavy (and so are Glocks that size).

0n the other hand, for extreme reliability, forget any pistol and get a revolver - 1 click == 1 bang, every single time, and you keep your brass (think forensics!) with you. With a speedloader, you've got the firepower, but really - it's the first hit that wins a fight, not how many bullets you've got, or the quickest first shot, or that silly "stopping power" metric. The first solid hit. I really like my Taurus ultralight Ti + Crimson Trace in .38 +p, because I can hide it on my tiny frame, so I have it with me (I even forget I have it on me, sometimes).
Both of those are double or single action, depending on how much time you've got - no need to "get it ready" if you're in a hurry, but safe to carry.

Something not handy to carry means you won't have it when you need it. So the big heavy pistol stays in the vehicle and so on. That might lead to what Maj John Plaster calls the dumbest you can possibly feel - seeing your hands empty when there's supposed to be a gun there.

To those who'd say a revolver is too slow, I refute it thus:

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Old 12-05-2011, 09:48 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by DoChenRollingBearing View Post:
Unobtanium, that was a great video! Thanks for posting it.

My Tai Chi instructor is a cop, he uses a .40 calber Glock. Glocks are supposed to VERY reliable (don´t jam, my Beretta 9 mm sometimes jams). If I get another handgun, it is likely to be a Glock, I would have to decide on which caliber.

Although I could make a case for myself that a Kimber .45 would be OK too...

EDIT:

I see that ancona has joined the ranks as a Supporter. Great choice of use of funds!
I have a compact Glock 36 (.45 ACP, 6 rounds) and would also like to add a full size Glock 21 (.45 ACP, 13 rounds).

Also have my eye on a Springfield XD45 or a Sig Sauer. A 1911 is also high on the wishlist simply because of the heritage and history behind that pistol.
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Old 12-06-2011, 06:28 AM   #6
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I enjoyed the Glock commercial in the OP. Thanks Unob.

DC - Practicing at the plate targets at my local range, I am faster at knocking down all 6 plates using a .357 magnum revolver (shooting.38 spcl for plinking) than with a 9mm semi-auto pistol. My revolver is a double action, but I practice with it as if it were single action - just works better for me that way (accuracy). I'm fastest overall using a Ruger Mark I .22lr, but that would not be my first choice in a self defense situation.

It's not just speed, but speed + accuracy that counts.
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Old 12-06-2011, 07:26 AM   #7
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I have a Glock 17, but I prefer my more compact Sig Pro SP 2009 9mm parabellum. Second up would be my FEG63 9mm Makarov. They are compact, concealable and reliable.
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Old 12-06-2011, 07:39 AM   #8
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Quote :
It's not just speed, but speed + accuracy that counts.
Yup. Now you're getting into heresy in some parts (single action) but not with me. I cock my revolver as part of the draw - helps me locate my grip, it adds no time. Make the first shot count, then you have more time for a second if required.

And you know, Jerry above isn't actually the fastest! Showman Bob Munden beats him with a .45 peacemaker for the first two shots.

Interestingly, S&W, mostly known for revolvers, also made the only 9mm pistol that's really shot super well here - I'll have to ask its owner what the model is, I like it too.

I'm a 1911 guy myself, but not for carry. Too big and heavy, and I won't carry cocked and locked. But gangs of fun in other situations, and accurate. To make them really reliable you need to either do the ramped barrel install, or eschew strange projectiles - either too-short or wide open hollow points will give trouble now and then with the standard setup. Some gunsmiths can tweak around that with careful magazine lip adjustments, but drop the mag and you start over with that.

What's cool about 1911 is that you can make one with no Colt parts at all these days. Only the small block Chevy has attained the same status.
Caspian frame, Wilson slide and barrel, Nowlin trigger group, someone else's grips, you get the idea. Here's one I made:
RaceGun.jpg
That's a Kimber .22 top I hand fitted to the same frame, but since I reload, it doesn't get much use here, there's no cost savings for me.
All the plating and anodizing and blueing is mine.

As I've mentioned elsewhere, the fastest on my range has been a Marlin .22 with a low power scope on the plates. We've had to make a special rule for that one. It's not realistic in some senses for self defense or carry so we only allow things like that to compete against one another.

One controversial and interesting issue is what caliber. No one really disputes that bigger is better for stopping a fight. On the other hand...
If you so much as wing a bad guy with a .45, you'd better not shoot him again, since no one will believe that second shot was self defense. On the other hand, with a .38-class gun, there are enough stories around about PCP crazed perps that you can empty the thing and not have to face some nasty issues in court later. I leave it to the reader to figure out which gives you more flexibility in a situation. Remember, claiming self-defense is admitting to a homicide - now we determine if it was justified or not.
Pretty scary stuff.
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Old 12-06-2011, 07:50 AM   #9
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Here in Texas, support for the Castle Doctrine is still very strong. Even Joe Horn was acquitted of malfeasance in a pretty questionable set of circumstances. That happened about 30 minutes away from where I live.
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Old 12-06-2011, 07:53 AM   #10
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Strong Castle Doctrine here in Florida as well.
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Old 12-06-2011, 08:17 AM   #11
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Here in VA too - but still if you kill someone, and admit it, you then enter a gory process of having committed a homicide and having to go to court over it to prove it was justified. You'll probably win, but...it's no fun and its not cheap either.

Malicious wounding can be worse, because the perp is alive to make up BS stories and complicate things, and has obviously suffered at your hands. Don't miss.
And don't live in a place where juries tend toward the bleeding-heart side of things.

That was kind of the subtext of using a smaller caliber and being able to use it "enough" to get the desired result.
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Old 12-06-2011, 08:50 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by DCFusor View Post:
Something very much like this actually happened in Arizona about a year ago. A guy trips over a cop car on the way in to rob a gun store. The people there described a scene very like this actually happening! It was like "who goes first on this turkey?". There really are perps that dumb out there. NRA had a field day reporting that one.

My CZ-97b in .45 ACP is the most reliable pistol I've ever owned (even with flying-ashtray hollow points), including Glocks, which I personally don't find a fit - which is not to say they're bad guns, they just don't fit me as well - you won't hear me dissing Glocks - from .40 up, they rock. I do like an explicit safety better. (ask Plaxico Burris about that one)
The CZ is more accurate for both me and friends who are Glock guys. But it's heavy (and so are Glocks that size).

0n the other hand, for extreme reliability, forget any pistol and get a revolver - 1 click == 1 bang, every single time, and you keep your brass (think forensics!) with you. With a speedloader, you've got the firepower, but really - it's the first hit that wins a fight, not how many bullets you've got, or the quickest first shot, or that silly "stopping power" metric. The first solid hit. I really like my Taurus ultralight Ti + Crimson Trace in .38 +p, because I can hide it on my tiny frame, so I have it with me (I even forget I have it on me, sometimes).
Both of those are double or single action, depending on how much time you've got - no need to "get it ready" if you're in a hurry, but safe to carry.

Something not handy to carry means you won't have it when you need it. So the big heavy pistol stays in the vehicle and so on. That might lead to what Maj John Plaster calls the dumbest you can possibly feel - seeing your hands empty when there's supposed to be a gun there.

To those who'd say a revolver is too slow, I refute it thus:
Agree completely on the CZ, I have an SP01 Tac and it is built like a tank and accurate, the .22 kit is brilliant. If I ever get a .45 semiauto it will be the 97bd.

I wish my snub .38 sounded like a machine gun the way Jerry's revolver does.

Quote :
Interestingly, S&W, mostly known for revolvers, also made the only 9mm pistol that's really shot super well here - I'll have to ask its owner what the model is, I like it too.
Maybe an M&P 9, they are pretty good guns from what I hear, the .40 version of it that I shot was pretty good (and I'm not a polymer/striker kind of guy).

Last edited by dontdeBasemebro; 12-06-2011 at 08:52 AM.
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Old 12-06-2011, 09:42 AM   #13
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Now that i'm moving back to Texas, I probably should look into getting a hand gun. With a toddler and a newborn though, I really want to get more comfortable with the safety aspect of owning a weapon.

Anyone have any suggestions on where to go in the DFW area for classes?
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Old 12-06-2011, 09:44 AM   #14
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Too far north for me. Find a local gun range and ask around.
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Old 12-06-2011, 10:05 AM   #15
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Jerry must have the strongest trigger finger of anyone living. Ever notice that all the really winning competitors have forearms as big as some people's legs? Sigh, that's not my bod, and never will be. Seems crucial to the good sort of gun control, though. For the weaker among us, a heavier gun seems to help, but is hard to carry. Just one of those trade-offs.

In my case, I'm kinda glad my ultralight can't be shot that fast by me. The kick is brutal with any round that actually gets any muzzle velocity - it's a stinger, even with a muzzle brake built in.

What I found with that, BTW, is most loads don't get going too fast out of snubbies, the powder just doesn't get burned in time. My best results are with a 148 gr wadcutter (shoved down flush or almost flush with the end of the brass) and 2.8 gr bullseye (very fast stuff). They get 750 or so fps, the brass itself acting like a little bit longer barrel.

"Self defense +P" loads make a big bang and a big flash, but I've had them clock under 500 fps - that's no good! And they tend to be lighter (125 gr) bullets too. A case of sound and fury signifying nothing.

Derek - kids will be kids. Keep the ammo separate, somehow, or lock up the whole mess - but most kids will figure out how to defeat that at some point, it's irresistible. With a pistol the risk is that you've left one in the chamber - there've been some accidents with "unloaded" guns due to that. Some pistols, like my FN 5-7, won't shoot without a mag, but that feature is dubious and I wouldn't count on it. Around here, we start teaching kids about guns real early - about 1rst grade time, with something easy like .22, so they know it's serious business and not a toy after seeing some destruction downrange (and that you don't shoot a handgun for fun without hearing protection!). Seems to help, the accident rate is really low to vanishing. NRA's Eddie Eagle program is good.

Now, my S&W mod 14 - that one's fast, comfortable, accurate. But it's kinda big for other than bullseye and general range fun. 6" barrel and red dot - little red dot == little black hole, all the time, very good feeling. Very fast on the plates as those things go, for me. But I'm not in Jerry's class by any means. I use it for teaching beginners - the red dot shows them their shake and wander dry and live firing and how critical an iron sight picture really is - while the basic accuracy and ease to shoot it well makes converts of them very easily. Never start a beginner with something hard to shoot well!

The Smith 14 and the CZ 97 are the only two handguns (out of too many to relate here, call it a 3 digit number) that I've not felt compelled to get inside of and "improve". Fine the way they are, there's just no improvements to be made on them. The CZ is the only one I really like shooting over iron sights. My snubby, I depend on the laser grips.

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Old 12-06-2011, 02:14 PM   #16
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DCFusor hit it right exactly on the head. SAFETY, SAFETY lessons and more SAFETY. If you raise the kids around weapons, teach them to respect them and drill the rules in to them, they will most likely be the safest people at the range. With no frame of reference, a small child can only really learn what you teach them. If you make it a positive experience, they will treat it positively. Between my wife, daughter and myself, we have a pile of guns knee deep, and treat all of them as if they are loaded unless they are torn down for cleaning. My daughter is 16, but has been shooting since she was seven. Her first rifle was an old pump .22 Rossi which she still has. She does teen mentoring at her private school with kids from less fortunate families who got scholarships. Part of the program is sharing hobbies. Naturally, her favorite hobby is cracking off a hundred with her SKS and fifty or sixty with her Mark II.

A nice gun safe can be had for a couple hundred samoleans at nearly any sporting goods store. Sportsmansguide.com has some good stuff, as does Cabella's. For ammo, CheaperThanDirt is a great place for pistol ammo and hunting ammo, but be careful with their milsurp stuff, because I got some really dirty .223 from them. The stuff was like shooting charcoal briquettes through my rifle and it was a grand master bitch to clean off.
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Old 12-06-2011, 03:10 PM   #17
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The Wolff steel cased ammo was so bad and the news got around enough that they changed their name to something else - but that charcoal is still out there. I've bought some "mil surplus" ammo that would jam any gun, very poorly remade. For awhile (maybe still) mil ammo wasn't sold to dealers - they are using a "better" powder formulation (better longer pressure curve and less flash) they weren't letting us civvies have, so the big houses had to pull bullets, give the military the powder back, and reload the primer-ed brass. Many didn't do a great job - I got a batch of 1000 where they didn't resize the shell necks, and the bullets were all different depths and some falling out - or shoved all the way back in, dangerous for a semi auto to shoot. An accident waiting to happen.

On top they used the crappiest bullets (uneven bases) imaginable. So I stay away from that stuff unless I'm just buying it for the brass to shove through the Dillon or the RCBS with new internals. The mil stuff in original packaging is OK it seems. But bulk in an ammo box, beware.

I think the new powder they've been using is similar to stuff now hitting the civvie market (superformance) so this might go away, but in the meantime it stinks to have paid even a surplus price for 1000 rounds and have only the brass and maybe the ??? surplus old powder safely use-able.

On top, my AR (heavily 'smithed by me) which shoots 1/4 moa with reloads shot this crap into 2 inches - with luck. So it's not even good for practice.

Also, take a magnet with you to gun shows - avoid the magnetic bullets (steel jacketed) if you can. They wear a barrel out really quickly - a few hundred rounds can ruin a nice one, though about 10 are handy for breaking a new one in - 10 of those is about like 100 of good bullets. Treated right, a good barrel can go a lot of thousands of rounds, so don't waste a good one in the name of "saving money" - new barrels aren't that cheap if they are any good.

The military can afford barrels - if you live though enough combat to wear one out, they're glad to give you another gun, so their AP ammo can be steel jacket with thin flashing and be hard on things. We're a little different out here.

My own rule is that no gun is unloaded unless I've unloaded it myself - and it's not been out of my sight since.

Ancona - fixed my comment..

Last edited by DCFusor; 12-06-2011 at 04:16 PM.
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Old 12-06-2011, 03:34 PM   #18
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I did not mean unloaded. See edited post.
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