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Old 05-22-2012, 04:32 PM   #1
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I need serious, sound advice

I'm a single dad, and I'm taking my 2 kids (8 year-old boy, 7 year-old girl) on vacation this summer, home to the US.

What do I do if the TSA tries to grab my kids' crotch? I need some real advice here. I've been thinking out every possible scenario, and I don't like how any of them end.
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Old 05-22-2012, 04:46 PM   #2
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My suggestions (note: I'm a foreigner)

- Find a small airport as a destination with less intrusive searches, maybe even private security instead of the TSA

- If possible, don't fly directly to the US? Fly to Mexico / Canada and then go by train or rent a camping vehicle to cross the border?

- Notify the local TSA office in advance (i.e. by letter) that the three of you will be travelling at a certain date. That you will not tolerate that your kids would be groped and/or separated from you during the procedure. That only officers of the same sex would be allowed to search your kids. Ask them to show the law that justifies their actions (they probably can't). Demand a written guarantee that they won't do a patdown.
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Old 05-22-2012, 05:09 PM   #3
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Thanks for the reply, I really do appreciate your input. As you rightly guessed, I'm also afraid of them trying to separate the kids from me. My daughter clings to me, even when we're with friends. It will be hard enough to get her to walk through the metal detector without me.

We're flying through Canada because I imagine it's better than the transfer at Newark. But we're going out of Houston on the way home. I have a hunch that writing them a letter would only draw more attention to me, and they would make sure to violate us extra.
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Old 05-22-2012, 05:35 PM   #4
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Mike, is there any way you could take a train?? I went to DC with my little bear a few years ago and we had an absolute blast on the train. It is an extremely cool and comfortable way to go. I got a family cabin and we did some meals in the room and some in the restaurant car. When you travel by train from Sanford [Orlando area] to DC, it's about twelve hundred bucks, which is about the cost of business class plane tickets. I don't have any idea how you are fixed for money, but I intend to travel by train again because my trip was so much fun and such a comfortable way to travel. Specifically, both my daughter and I like to move about and find it hard to sit in one spot for hours on end on a plane,, so the train was awesome. We could "do laps" up and down through the cars, we could stop for a soda or whatnot at the snack bar and we could go to the observation deck on the bi-level car and just watch the scenery. It was by far the coolest travel she and I have ever done. Well, with the notable exception of a ride on a real submarine in Barbados.
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Old 05-22-2012, 05:54 PM   #5
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Fly into and out of other countries, it is the only way to really avoid TSA unless you can spend on private/charter flights out of small airports. I've looked into that and it is very expensive.

Any asking, demanding, lettering and etc. will only make the beatdown worse and you'll probably be hauled off without a word.

There are other places to visit.
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Old 05-22-2012, 08:00 PM   #6
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I do not like the scanners.

Consider this. The plane can never be secure. Why? Because the TSA person does not ride on the plane.

As for me- I would choose the grope before the scanner. If it bothers you that much- then maybe you should not travel. BTW-
trains are not necessarily TSA free.

Now to answer you concern- you can by a seat on a private plane and not have to go thru the grope.
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Old 05-22-2012, 08:03 PM   #7
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BTW- the fear of being separated is a bigger fear.
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Old 05-22-2012, 08:52 PM   #8
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You know, I don't mind being groped too awfully bad.
I guess I got used to it. The first 13 times I flew after 9/11, I was pulled out of the crowd, had my luggage searched, and groped by TSA. My brother, who often flew with me on hunting trips out west, would laugh and laugh......then laugh even harder when TSA told him it was totally random.
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Old 05-23-2012, 12:22 AM   #9
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Take every effort to ensure your children aren't wearing or carrying any metal, you only get the pat down if you set of the metal detector, hopefully that way you may avoid it alltogether.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:36 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by ancona View Post:
Mike, is there any way you could take a train?? I went to DC with my little bear a few years ago and we had an absolute blast on the train. It is an extremely cool and comfortable way to go. I got a family cabin and we did some meals in the room and some in the restaurant car. When you travel by train from Sanford [Orlando area] to DC, it's about twelve hundred bucks, which is about the cost of business class plane tickets. I don't have any idea how you are fixed for money, but I intend to travel by train again because my trip was so much fun and such a comfortable way to travel. Specifically, both my daughter and I like to move about and find it hard to sit in one spot for hours on end on a plane,, so the train was awesome. We could "do laps" up and down through the cars, we could stop for a soda or whatnot at the snack bar and we could go to the observation deck on the bi-level car and just watch the scenery. It was by far the coolest travel she and I have ever done. Well, with the notable exception of a ride on a real submarine in Barbados.

We already bought the plane tickets, and I don't have enough vacation time to take the train. But I will totally consider that next time, if the TSA hasn't taken over the trains by then too.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:39 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Penn View Post:
I do not like the scanners.

Consider this. The plane can never be secure. Why? Because the TSA person does not ride on the plane.

As for me- I would choose the grope before the scanner. If it bothers you that much- then maybe you should not travel. BTW-
trains are not necessarily TSA free.

Now to answer you concern- you can by a seat on a private plane and not have to go thru the grope.
Yeah, personally I would prefer the grope over the scanner. But I don't want to teach my kids that it's okay for strangers to grab their crotch. Nor do I want to teach them that it's okay to be treated like a criminal and have our rights violated.

80% of my income goes to taxes. You think I can afford a private plane? hahaha
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:41 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Penn View Post:
BTW- the fear of being separated is a bigger fear.
Absolutely. If we had a nuclear family, I could put up a fight and the consequences that follow, and their mom could take the kids. But I'm alone, so....
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:42 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by HCA1961 View Post:
You know, I don't mind being groped too awfully bad.
Then the tyranny has won. This is what they want; obedient slaves.
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Old 05-23-2012, 07:08 AM   #14
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http://thenewamerican.com/usnews/ite...nced-pat-downs

Should you touch you and call it a game?

"TSA regional security director James Marchand explained: “You try to make it as best you can for that child to come through. If you can come up with some kind of game to play with a child, it makes it a lot easier.”

But CLP's Ken Wooden explains that telling a child they are participating in a game “is one of the most common ways” for sexual predators to engage children in inappropriate contact. Likewise, because children “don’t have the sophistication” to differentiate between the pat-down at the airport and sexual assault, the TSA procedures may desensitize them to sexual molestation."


Or should we irradiate you?

"Despite a report filed by ProPublica that the scanners could cause "anywhere from six to 100 U.S. airline passengers each year [to] get cancer," plus a variety of expert testimonies on the dangers of the technology, and the fact that the European Union has banned the machines, the TSA has elected to continue the use of the scanners nationwide."

"...the TSA has other, safer types of scanners, known as millimeter-wave scanners, that the agency says are as effective as the backscatter scanners; but it has chosen to continue deploying the backscatter scanners even though they could adversely affect the health of the flying public.”
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Old 05-23-2012, 08:13 AM   #15
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i agree with the smaller airport recommendation. I used to fly out of redmond, or all the time and never had problems. It was only on the return flight where i'd have to deal with some bs. Security is still good at the smaller airports but they aren't on the stupid groping level.
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Old 05-23-2012, 08:31 AM   #16
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Flying is such a hastle.. I doubt I will ever fly again. Chicago is 640 miles from here- and the 12 hour drive is not much harder then flying.... and then I have a car when I get there.
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Old 05-23-2012, 09:14 AM   #17
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I really hope this idea of Congressman John Mica gains traction:
http://www.infowars.com/congressman-...-to-ditch-tsa/


"Mica has produced a study which estimates that over $1 billion dollars would be saved if the nation’s 35 busiest airports switched from TSA to private screeners."

"Congressman John Mica has called for “most” of the nation’s busiest airports to evict TSA screeners and replace them with private security..."
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:36 AM   #18
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Well, I'm back, and we managed to evade the scanners and groping by pure luck. Thank goodness because I had a hard enough time getting my 7-year-old princess to walk through the metal detector without holding me.
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Old 07-09-2012, 03:17 PM   #19
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good to hear it Mike

and good travel experience for the young uns.
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:48 PM   #20
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The TSA makes my blood absolutely boil. I think they can sense it because I have NEVER been patted down or required to be irradiated. I am a member of Clear program so I can bypass a lot of the bulshit to begin with.

Clear Traveler is not for everyone, as they require a shitload of info, fingerprints and an iris scan, but since I have a .Gov clearance [level to remain.....something you have to guess] I have already given everything to my overlords, to include DNA, in case there is a launch pad accident and the only thing they find is a tooth or something.

Although I never submit without a fight, my choice of profession and my dedication to a firm with whom I am in my eighteenth year, I truly had no choice other than starting completely over at a fairly ripe age in the job market.

Either way, the Clear program is young, but it is in place and used at around six major airports, to include MCO which is my home airport.
BTW, if anyone groped my little girl, I can guarantee you three things:

1. One or both of us will go to the hospital, and if it's one, it will be the groper.
2. It will be violent, very very violent, since I'm that crazy fucker that goes all spider monkey on you.
3. They will never grope a little girl again.

[ Either way, I think it's a win -win, don't you?]
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