German Court Demands Bundesbank Audit Sovereign Gold Holdings

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http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-...ands-bundesbank-audit-sovereign-gold-holdings

German Court Demands Bundesbank Audit Sovereign Gold Holdings


The German court of auditors (Bundesrechnungshof) has demanded that the Bundesbank undertake an audit of its gold reserves. In an 'audit-the-fed' style effort, the court wants to ensure that the nearly 3400 tons of gold is in fact in existence - 'because stocks have never been checked for authenticity and weight'. Furthermore, the Bundesbank's gold is stored in three other vaults around the world: The Bank of England, The Bank of France, and the US Federal Reserve. The court questions the practice of relying on a written confirmation from the custodians (foreign central banks). The decision means negotiating with the three foreign central banks for physical verification but in anticipation, the Bundesbank has begun the process of shipping 50 tons per year from the Fed back to Germany for the next three years.

Germany's apparent (unchecked and unverified) gold holdings are second only to the USA's (just as unaudited levels)...



Via Spiegel:

 
Why bother? You can't eat it! /sarc
 
3400 ton reserves. They want to start "50t/year" exports. Let's say they have 1/3 of their reserves in Fed's NY vault, say 1000t (I think they have majority of their stack there, but just for the sake of argument). It would only take them 20 years to ship it home

Well good luck with that!

:rotflmbo:
 
It's pretty clear that they've cut a deal with the FED not to withdraw more.
That in itself is very disturbing because such deals wouldn't be necessary if all the gold was truely there and/or not leased out
 
...the effect being - more and more peoples & institutions in Germany "want it to happen", which I presume will be the ONLY effect :rotflmbo:
 
By the way, this is not a court (the "Bundesrechnungshof") in the technical sense of the word. ZH got that wrong. It's an accountability institution that gives recomendations for branches of government on how to deal with taxpayer assets in a responsible fashion. So it's more like the GAO ( http://www.gao.gov/ ) in the US.
 
...well the funny thing is, even if the gold is sold, let alone "leased out", it doesn't necessarily need to leave the vault, physically - quite often it doesn't, from what I've learned. It is supposed to be one of gold's strengths in investment/monetary realms - it's main purpose is to exist, and since it is "good delivery", well, it is enough to change the claim of ownership (until someone indeed redeems it physically - which doesn't happened too often with these particular lots of CB-owned gold, I think).

So it would be not enough, to audit the vaults, without auditing the books, and maybe even cross-auditing them with the books of bullion banks, COMEXes and so forth - even if the gold might still be there in Fed's vaults, but there could be (and most probably, there IS) more than one claim on every piece there exist.


Go physical, and
 
Go physical, and

It's still good to have money in the system in form of physical certs of the miners.. maybe i'm crazy but I still see value in a lot of those companies and believe they will get crazy price action when gold goes into it's mania phase.
 
well definitely, the only problem is, I don't know a :doodoo: about miners stocks (although squirreling away little bits of information from more experienced guys, here, there and everywhere )! And my coins cannot (physically) go bankrupt.

But I totally agree with your points on miners stocks - have seen some (contrarian) reports, that demonstrate how very much hated gold companies currently are.
 
I've just read the full report about the German gold reserves and it's quite an eye opener. It's posted here (in German): http://www.gata.org/files/GermanGoldAuditorsReport-10-22-2012.pdf

Lots of parts of the report have been censored for the public, but here are
Some of the highlights:

p. 13 of the pdf (paraphrasing): doubting that the gold in foreign central bank vault is actually there, would have "massive political implications" according to the Bundesbank.

p. 13-15: The NY FED "stores" foreign gold "gratis", but excludes ANY responsibility for losses of the gold. Bundesbank representatives were NOT allowed to enter the vault where Germany's gold is supposedly stored. They only could visit the entrance area of the vault :doodoo: .

p. 24: Under the title "preview" a whole section is censored. One can deduct from the following sentence that it has to do with an agreement between the FED and the Bundesbank about German gold which is stored in NY. Something is fishy there

p. 33: Of course the Bundesbank suggested that the report should be classified and kept from the German public :doodoo:
 
@ swissaustrian

THAT is too bad, that they will keep any of their audit results a secret. I for one would like to know if our Fed cheats the Germans or anybody else. Would the gold bars the Fed ships back to Germany be the same ones the Germans originally sent the Fed? Inquiring minds want to know!

All this secrecy..., makes me want more physical!
 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...hed-London-gold-holdings-in-mystery-move.html
 
The report also claimed that the Bundesbank had slashed its holdings in London from 1,440 tons to 500 tons in 2000 and 2001, allegedly because storage costs were too high.
The BOE is the only central bank which charges ANY storage fees according to the report. Neither the FED nor the BDF (Banque de France) charge fees. Additionally, the report doesn't say that they flew the whole gold to Frankfurt.
Seems to me like this is a typical case of bad translation.

I guess the Bundesbank rather leased out a large chunk of the gold at the BOE and got it back later at the NY FED's vault in form of different bars. That makes much more sense
They claim that they have no lease agreements outstanding today, but that might just be due to triangular agreements involving other central banks or international institutions like the BIS. One can easily hide a lease behind a swap with another central bank or international institution.
E.g.: the Bundesbank and the NY FED swap 1000 standard bars (400oz each) for 1 years. The BB gets 1000 bars for one year and does nothing with them. The NY FED then leases the 1000 BB bars out for 1 year to a third party (usually a bullion bank) on behalf of the BB. After that the NY FED pays the BB a swap "fee" which in fact is the lease rate that the NY FED collected from the third party minus a small profit for the NY FED. This way the BB can claim that they don't lease any gold as of today because they're hiding it behind swap agreements with other entitities.
 
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Great insight by THE expert on German gold, Lars Schall, on the edge with Max Keiser:
 
James Turk believes that Bundesbank has effectively lost (most of) Germanys gold through gold swaps, just as I said above...

http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldn...k_-_The_Entire_German_Gold_Hoard_Is_Gone.html
 
...all this talk about leased-out gold. My question goes like this:

1. No doubts, that it is double accounting, magically doubling the amount of gold being leased out (as I understand it - both CB keeps it on the books, and the leasing-out bank suddenly has it on THEIR books)
2. 0.99999999999(9) chance, that this scam is happening for a good while.
3. Depending on the "borrower" of that leased gold, it might, but more probably it DOES NOT LEAVE the original vault (say NY Fed's). That, from what I've learned, is rather a standard practice. Gold is rarely physically moved, unless there's a real business need for it. It rather gets allocated, or maybe even not that.
4. So, what we end up with, ni case of event, that more than one party shows up with the ownership claim? Who's gonna prevail, who's going to find himself on the receiving end of the stick?

5. All that said, I bet my money that "possession is 9/10th of ownership" - so I'd say, that all the gold "borrowers", in case of financial/Au SHTF, and all others who did not took possession in time (poor German bastards, the WW2 war reparations have finally caught up with them ), are being taken for a ride. When scandal erupts, well, scandal will be there anyway, and the ones with greater powers (physical ownership), will just cut their loses, and tell others "screw you" (no doubts in some other, nicer wording). And those who will get raped - well, I hope they have a big fecking jar of Vaseline at their disposal, because they are going to get it so deeply up their arses, they might actually see the end of it sticking out of their mouth.

My opinion, based solely on the fact (?), that lending gold out doesn't necessarily mean, that gold has left it's original storage place - more likely it did not.
 
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that's my point. First , in this case, is the one, who keeps the gold (physically), and have means to keep it (US Army)

They are, after all, not that much different from the preppers, these CBs - "come and take your gold, Dzermany ffftt:"
 
I think it was a brilliant move for Germany to start repatriating just 50 tons/year. It's a small enough amount not to give rise to any credible objections from the custodians. It's large enough to start making a dent in the stack. The only real question is - will there be enough time to siphon it all home before the game ends? I expect Germany may increase the amount they repatriate down the road if they think they can get away with it.
 
....actually, great point PMBug. I am sure they are trying to do this as fast as possible, without rising too much suspicions, and unleashing the panic "gold rush".


...just another indicator that this here lot is on the right track :wave:
 
that's my point. First , in this case, is the one, who keeps the gold (physically), and have means to keep it (US Army)

They are, after all, not that much different from the preppers, these CBs - "come and take your gold, Dzermany ffftt:"

That's what Jim Rickards has said in his book "currency wars". The US owns 8000+ tons, but it possesses 15000+. If tshtf, all these countries who are storing their gold in the US are effd.

DeGaulle knew this in 1965:
 
Great thread and comments!

I too wonder if Germany will/would release results of any testing done on their gold. Are they (would they be) the original bars Germany earlier sent? Or newer 2012 Engelhards? Hmm...

For me, almost ANYTIME ANY questions like this come up, it always points me back to the same thought as always: Buy gold while you can and while it is cheap!

Be your own central bank!





 
Well, maybe 50tons/year was too much after all... Bundesbank feeling pressure?
More: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-10-27/bundesbanks-official-statment-where-its-gold-and-isnt
 
The Doc @ SilverDoctors had an interesting interview with Ned Naylor-Leyland:
More: http://www.silverdoctors.com/ned-na...have-no-chance-of-getting-out-with-any-metal/
 

More: http://gata.org/node/11898
 

More: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-...-ytd-total-surpasses-official-indian-holdings
 

More: http://gata.org/node/11957

If the report is to be believed, Austria has "un-leased" 64% of their gold reserves over the last decade.
 
Hilarious Keiser Report on the Austrian gold story (and more):

 
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