Welcome to the PMBug forums - a watering hole for folks interested in gold, silver, precious metals, sound money, investing, market and economic news, central bank monetary policies, politics and more. You can visit the forum page to see the list of forum nodes (categories/rooms) for topics.
Why not register an account and join the discussions? When you register an account and log in, you may enjoy additional benefits including no Google ads, market data/charts, access to trade/barter with the community and much more. Registering an account is free - you have nothing to lose!
I have been watching he Ukraine theing with great interest. For many hundreds of years, this region has waffled back and forth between Russia and independent region. Why it is suddenly within the providence of the brand new [relatively anyway] EU or even the USA to interfere, I cannot figure out. I do know that if the Russian section of Ukraine goes from this separation to being a powerhouse, and the EU dominated side gets strip mined of assets by the IMF [a guaranteed event IMHO] we'll see some dramatic contrast that will open the eyes of Greeks, Turks, Italians and Spaniards. They will finally see the Euronannycrats for what they are and separate themselves from the Union immediately.
The entire EU project was dreamed up by the very same assholes responsible for the worlds financial mess and revolves around nothing other than money. It has not a single thing to do with freedom, trade, movement within the EU or any other such nonsense. It was all about redistributing the poor of Europe throughout Europe so the weight of social programs was borne more or less equally by all the countries in Europe, rather than entire depressed countries like the Balkans, Romania, et. al., bearing their won weight for their own poor decision making and bad legislation.
One look at the British Roma infestation is pure testament to the complete and utter failure of the EU idea. The Roma do not want jobs. Period. They want to suck the teat and live off the largesse of the richer nations of Europe. I challenge you to name just one Roma individual that has done a single solitary beneficial thing that the rest of the world applauded. Just one.
See what I mean?
11C1P,
Russia did not barge in, they held a vote in the Crimea and decided they wanted to be part of Russia and not the EU.
The skies in the western 1/2 of our state our currently lit up with them burning off the excess gas that no one wants to allow them to ship overseas and they've run out of room to store. It pisses me off to no end to see all that potential profit literally going up in flames, especially when one of the main things stopping it is the environmentalnuts who don't want pipelines, refineries built or ships to transport it. Much better just to burn it off into the atmosphere 24/7 for years and years.
Soo........we should g3et involved in yet another war? With Russia? In their own back yard?
I seem to remember that both Napoleon and Hitler made exactly the same, nation bankrupting decisions.
I am not saying this is necessarily right, just that it's none of our damn business. i do however, stand by the statement that Crimea will be far, far better off under Russian rule than Ukraine will be under EU - IMF control. And I believe it will be by a huge margin. Like I said, for the EU-IMF this is all about asset mining and stripping the people of whatever remains of their money. One look at Greece should tell the tale.
I thought this argument was put to rest long, long ago. How exactly do you propose to get the NG there?
edited to add the infrastructure required is incredibly complex, and certainly not profitable
Sure, it's too hard to build a pipe line and boats. (even though they do it already for a plenty healthy profit) So if you think something would be difficult you say don't bother? Glad you weren't around when they build Hoover dam or started the space program, or signed the Declaration of Independence, or planned the D-day invasion, and on and on.
I am going to give you the same answer DCFuser gave me; you need to get a science book and read it, so you can understand physics. You cannot move liquid NG the same way you move oil by boat.
You can tell me that the sun revolves around the earth by your "science" but that does not make it so. It would be you that needs a science book.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LNG_carrier
http://www.coselle.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_natural_gas_pipelines
http://www.enterpriseproducts.com/operations/NglPipelinesServices.shtm
So some guy spouting off that the technology doesn't exist PROVES that it doesn't. Well then I say Australia doesn't exist either! I guess despite all the evidence that it does, means it doesn't. Then an article that says if because they don't have enough rail or pipeline to move the oil along with the feds & some states not allowing drilling production will go down. What a shocker! Even though that makes my point for me that we need to build more pipelines and increase rail capacity and allow for more drilling to help the economy you point to it as proof it won't help. Oh wait, I forgot you think the technology doesn't exist. Tell all the people at your next flat earth society meeting I said hi.
so you call people names you don't agree with? Nice! Actually, I was trying to point out that it was too expensive to transport gas across the ocean (for a profit) and the fact that we are destroying our own environment in the pursuit of NG (fracking). But never underestimate the ignorance of the cornicopians, they will always find a way to promote business as usual....until they can't. Which is looking more and more like the very near future....the meme that technology will save us is why we are in overshoot NOW....:wave:
You cannot move liquid NG the same way you move oil by boat ?
Im a bit confused ........
http://www.rivieramm.com/publications/lng-world-shipping-3
There seems to have been a fair amount of risk money spent on LNG terminals and boats,
suggesting there has to be ways of liquifying ( at source? ) in order to be able to subsequently ship the stuff.
I cheerfully admit to not knowing anything about LNG (-:
Don't cloud "science" with facts. :judge:
the fact that they flare off the gas in ND tells us something though .........
I don't know how many members here read Mish, but he posted a very relevant video just a little while ago that I want to share here. It is a video discussing transportation and distribution of LNG and should prove at the very least, informational:
http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2014/04/arms-of-behemoth-interesting-video-on.html
Take the quiz fellas..
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-04-01/guest-post-absurdity-us-natural-gas-exports
If you honestly believe that the US is suddenly going to be able to go toe to toe with Russia on natural gas exports, you've fallen for some of the most ridiculous propaganda ever espoused by the MSM.
Charif Souki, Cheniere’s chief executive, said that the idea of his company’s exports alone liberating Europe from Russia’s Gazprom was “nonsense” and that only six to eight of 20-plus proposed rival export projects were “real”.
...
The east-west stand-off over Ukraine has sparked a political debate over whether the US should loosen its energy export restrictions so Europeans can buy liquefied natural gas, or LNG, from America’s shale energy boom.
Asked if Cheniere’s terminal could rescue eastern European countries from their dependence on Russia, Mr Souki said: “It’s flattering to be talked about like this, but it’s all nonsense. It’s so much nonsense that I can’t believe anybody really believes it.”
Mr Souki said the only ones he considered to be real were the six to eight that had started a separate process – which he said entailed $100m in costs – of gaining permits from the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission, or Ferc, which assesses environmental and safety standards.
“Until somebody tells me they’re willing to spend $100m, I don’t consider them real,” he said.
Mr Souki said he had no control over where his customers would sell that LNG. “I’m pretty sure they will be opportunistic and, if they need it for their home market, they will take it for their own markets and, if they don’t need it, it will go somewhere else.”
How is that environmentalist propaganda? Nothing in there discounts natural gas as a viable energy source. It explains why US prices are artificially low.
If we've got so much natural gas, why are we importing it? I'm guessing you didn't even read the article because the idea that we could switch to nat gas without billions in infrastructure spending is preposterous. Let alone be able to export it and "save" Europe.
As for bashing zerohedge, you must be new here. Zerohedge is really good.
In fact.. they had another article pop up today that shows how Europe just folded on this issue.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-04-11/putin-tells-europe-pay-ukraines-gazprom-bill-or-else
We have to be realistic and not base our opinions on nationalistic propaganda. We do not have the ability to compete with Russia in the natural gas arena. We consume more nat gas than we produce and import an absolute shit load every year. Obama signing a gas deal wont fix this.
Oh.. and ANOTHER post that links to a financial times article..
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-...rom-due-nat-gas-exports-nonsense-cheniere-ceo
But what does the CEO of Cheniere know?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?