JPM Crashing ???

rblong2us

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yeah been following this little show
kinda feels good but could be the start of something very bad

always got to allow for zerohedge making things seem a bit more dramatic than they need to though
 

escobar

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These banks really make me sick. They are like blackjack junkies. They bet balls to the wall and when it works out they get paid a ton when it doesnt they just get bailed out, can't let the financial system fail etc. craziest legalized racket there is.
 

pmbug

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...
"Just because we're stupid doesn't mean everybody else was," Dimon added. Investigation into trade was started by a Wall Street Journal report, Dimon said, which led to his admitting the mistake "violated the Dimon rule."

Bloomberg News reported in April that a single JPMorgan trader in London, known in the bond market as "the London whale," was making such large trades that he was moving prices in the $10 trillion market.
...

Yeah, JPM never manipulates markets. Tin foil hat suckers. :paperbag:
 

Jetstream

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yeah been following this little show
kinda feels good but could be the start of something very bad

always got to allow for zerohedge making things seem a bit more dramatic than they need to though
Frankly, I am getting less enamoured with ZH by the week. Still drop by, but there are very few comments worth reading below the opinion articles.
 

benjamen

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Local news channel today said something about JPM losing 2 billion dollars over the past 6-8 weeks, but I didn't catch the whole story.

Should be interesting! :popcorn:
 

ancona

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I just read that the losses for JPM prop desk are something like 4 billion instead of the reported 2 billion. So, if these monkeys have a couple of trillion dollars worth of market presence, isn't a few billion dollars just a bit of chump change?

<sarc>
 
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bushi

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ancona - well of course, couple of billions that way or another - that is apparently the way they think - honestly, why shouldn't they, if instead of see some heads rolling, Uncle Sam is always to the rescue, when things go wrong.

PMBug, I've seen that piece about "Jamie Dimon tapeworm" - I must admit, Max Kaiser is sometimes over the top in how he reports that whole financial cesspit (though he is always right with regards of what he is saying), but that one was h.i.l.a.r.i.o.u.s :rotflmbo:

Obviously, I do believe that all of this will end badly, and it has to start with something "too big to bail"* - so I am awaiting the inevitable with mixed emotions - I do know it is needed to flush all that scum out of the system, and even rebuild the system itself - but it ain't going to happen, without some EXTREME disturbances, both politically, socially, and economically. You just DON'T change systems of that size, complexity, and powerful connections, unless you are absolutely FORCED to do that by the "higher need" circumstances.

Is it a beginning of the end - no... it has begun in 2006, if not in 1989 (when Russian empire went under - first and foremost, financially). It is just another stage in the final act, I suppose...

* "too big to bail", used with regards to our Her Majesty Financial Institutions, I thereby claim copyrights :) Please use it as often as you wish, together with that license/disclaimer, and send some money my way every time you do so :)
 

ancona

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Too big to bail is the lynchpin in the system which if pulled, collapses the whole fucking thing. We had all better be careful what we wish for here. These monstrosities need to be carefully and slowly dismantled and made to be a much smaller size. Failure of a Goldman or JP Morgan sized firm would burn down the entire financial complex in less than a fortnight.
 

bushi

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...I am fully aware, ancona... That is why I have mixed emotions, but on the other hand, I do not think there really is another way than a shock therapy, not with all the connections, power, and the amounts of speculations in a totally abstract bets, that are at play here.

There will be a hell to pay for everybody - and especially, for have-nots, I suppose. I just can't see it working out another way. I wish I was wrong, though, and that there would be some moderately painful way of dismantling that cesspit, instead of extremely painful one.
 

ancona

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Yeah, the descent in to hell will be long and painful, even for folks that have prepareed themselves.
 

BigJim

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DOW,S&P,Nasdaq,ALL UP!!!
Metals Down...
Move along now....Huge JPM losses mean nothing...


GOD BLESS OUR TROOPS!!!
 

benjamen

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http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...eet-just-kids-playing-dynamite-165144546.html

Let me get this straight, it should be illegal for companies to take risks and make a losing bet?! :rotflmbo:

a) If a company goes bankrupt, DO NOT bail it out! This only encourages risk taking behavior!

b) For all of those that would complain about the little guy's that get hurt because thier bank went under, shouldn't it be thier responsibility to make sure the company they had thier life savings to is solvent?

This would be like giving all of your money to an investment company that picks the wrong stock and you lose all your money. Instead of taking personal responsibility for picking a bad investment firm, you tell the governement to give that investment firm billions of dollars so you can get your money back?
:noevil:
 

ancona

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JPM just lost the 36 handle. I guess her investors don't like taking it up the ass. The real comedy today is Groupon. The stock is up 18% as of this writing in one day. It would have been nice to have known that on Friday.
 

benjamen

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It is bad when even CNN notices the conflict of interest:
http://money.cnn.com/2012/05/21/news/economy/jamie-dimon-new-york-fed/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2

Also interesting is the required way to pick FED board members:
"The law requires that three of those nine members, dubbed "Class A" directors, are bankers from the region. The other six must represent the public, particularly in the interests of agriculture, commerce, industry, services, labor and consumers."
 

pmbug

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It will be interesting to see what happens if JPM closes below the silver spot price. Max Keiser has said in the past it would cause significant problems for them. I never did spend much time trying to understand his POV on the issue, but I have noticed that the two haven't crossed convincingly yet.
 

ancona

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'Bug,
I think it is a psychological thing. I think that when 30 is broken, they may be in bigger trouble. BAC is chasing a five handle pretty hard today. I seem to remember reading that if it breaks five for more than two sessions, a lot of funds will have to bail on htem, leading to waterfall selling.
 

rblong2us

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It will be interesting to see what happens if JPM closes below the silver spot price. Max Keiser has said in the past it would cause significant problems for them. I never did spend much time trying to understand his POV on the issue, but I have noticed that the two haven't crossed convincingly yet.

Max reckoned theres some huge derivative bets on this that will take em down. got to be for a certain number of days i think.
but then up popped 'Wynter Benton' saying similar things and it all got a bit messy.
Naturally I did my bit and bought 50kg at around $40 :wave:
 

ancona

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50Kg's?!?!?!?z.

Ho,ly crap man! I have enough trouble scraping enough off to buy 50 oz.!!
 

rblong2us

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thats coz you put your $s into awesome pieces of super destructo machines (-:

My metals are my pension fund and even then may be reduced to nothing, as its in vaults in london (silver) and zurich (gold) and i may not have the strongest claim when tshtf ........

a fully fuelled digger in the hand is worth a lot more than a theoretical pile of shiny when that happens.
 

benjamen

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Good article, along with a funny political cartoon on JP Morgan Chase:
http://usawatchdog.com/derivative-scandals-taxpayer-supported-gambling/

“One thing seems clear about JPMorgan Chase’s $2 billion loss. It’s no longer $2 billion. It’s likely much higher. The number being bandied about now is closer to a range of $6 billion to $7 billion..."

"Investment banker James Rickards recently weighed in on derivative trading and said, “In fact, the bet is no more complicated than putting money on red at roulette. As a last resort, the executives hide behind the flag of free market capitalism when in fact they are the new welfare queens with government subsidies galore...."
 

pmbug

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So, it's been a few years and it looks like no one is going to jail over the London Whale trades:
The case against two traders in the infamous “London Whale” case appears to have fallen apart after the Whale himself, considered a key witness, accused J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. Chief Executive Jamie Dimon of setting him up as a fall guy.

The U.S. Department of Justice revealed Friday that it is seeking permission from a judge to dismiss the charges against two former J.P. Morgan JPM, +0.43% derivatives traders, Javier Martin-Artajo and Julien Grout. According to the announcement, a key reason for dropping the case is because prosecutors no longer believed Bruno Iksil’s testimony could be relied upon to prosecute “based on a review of recent statements and writings made by Iksil.”

Iksil, the trader nicknamed “the London Whale” and a former colleague of the two defendants at J.P. Morgan, recently accused Dimon and other J.P. Morgan senior executives of using him as “ a screen” in the effort. According to a statement from the Justice Department, the prosecutors had also failed to win approval for the extradition of Martin-Artajo and Grout from Spain and France.
...

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/ch...mie-dimon-of-making-him-a-fall-guy-2017-07-21

Bruno Iksil, the former JPMorgan Chase & Co (JPM.N) trader at the center of the "London Whale" trading scandal, has accused the Wall Street bank's Chief Executive James Dimon of laying the ground for the $6.2 billion loss.

In an account on his website, Iksil, a French national who traded credit derivatives for JPMorgan in London, also blamed senior executives at the bank.
...

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-jpmorgan-londonwhale-idUSKBN19A2UA

...
  • ...
  • The senior executives chose indeed “Iksil” to work as a “screen” for them in late 2010. It was a complete setup manufactured around RWA projective but pointless modeled reductions and misleading risk reports about stress test limits breaches. The executives promoted “Iksil” without changing his role and responsibilities. They gave him quite specific paradoxical orders despite his alerts all along 2011 and 2012. They finally left his name being relentlessly placated through the media starting on April 6th 2012 as things were just getting worse and worse for them.
  • ...
  • At the end of the day about $50 bln changed hands in the second quarter 2012 between a mass of investors and some “happy insiders”. Jp Morgan made about $25 billion or more on the event for itself as its public accounting reports show through the generation of what is called “tangible capital” or “hard capital” (10-Q and 10-K reports filed with the SEC).
  • One may summarize the trading scandal as: when the CIO of JP Morgan had lost $1 billion dollar, Jp Morgan as a whole had made $4 billion for itself net of its CIO loss. The Jp Morgan CIO lost in whole $6.3 billion which led to an ultimate profit at Jp Morgan of more than $25 billion in 2012.

http://londonwhalemarionet.monsite-orange.fr/
 

rblong2us

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If they have a credible defence that their superiors colluded / encouraged their activity and the organisation is considered to be 'too important' systemically to allow it to be compromised, then the cases get pulled.
Not rocket science

Jail is for evil cannabis growers and users and anyone else who might threaten the profit margins of the corporates.
 
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