Water as emergency prep

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searcher

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Philly is going through a problem with possible contaminated water right now. Here's some personal observations.

Yesterday I went to Shoprite early (around 6:10AM) and was a bit surprised to see the parking lot was pretty full. Most of the people I saw in the store were loaded up with bottled water. Didn't recognize any of the faces. Most were probably from the city.

Hit Sam's Club after breakfast (around 8:30AM) and noticed the parking lot was jam packed. Store crowded with employees directing foot traffic in certain areas. Most peeps loaded up on bottled water. Store dude told me they had started to ration water to 4 cases per person. Heard they ran out or water around 1PM.

Throughout the day my FB page had peeps showing empty shelves in different places they had went to.

- Best to have at least 3 days of water on hand if you can do it. More is better.

- Water filters are a good thing. Recommend having one. DYODD when shopping for one.

- In a pinch you can fill up pots and containers

- Don't wait until an emergency hits. Prep while times are good.

 

LOOKING FOR WATER IN PHILADELPHIA​

Premiered 3 hours ago


Come Sail with The Philly Captain as he shows you what the retail stores look like In Philadelphia after the city sent out an alert saying residents should drink bottled water 8:52
 
searcher said:
...
- Water filters are a good thing. Recommend having one. DYODD when shopping for one.
...
Click to expand...
See here:

Fresh Water From Seawater?

I would be interested in hearing members' ideas on devices or methods to make fresh water from seawater. Solar stills? I cannot find any in my city. Reverse osmosis? Any comments? Water for me is TEOTWAWKI prep item No. 1 for me. When I finish the book (Survivors by James Wesley, Rawles...
www.pmbug.com www.pmbug.com
 
Brita is Okay, Pur is better or get a Burkey from a prep site. I would still boil Brita or Pur before putting it through a filter. I live on a NW WI lake half the time and have a system an generator. In the townhouse I do Brita on all consumed water. I bring gallons from the lake home to the city it goe through our reverse osmosis system.
 
I have three five-gallon containers for water - I fill them up regularly at a reverse-osmosis water dispenser in our local warehouse-style grocery. I'm seldom with less than ten gallons, although I rotate.

In a case as described, I think it would be less costly to just drive to another metropolitan area and fill up with 20 or so gallons of water, instead of paying ungodly bottled-water prices, probably jacked up with the emergency.

I'd look for a hotel, or some sort of place that has a lot of public traffic, and presumably lots of water use. You don't want to drain off a tap that hasn't been run in a year or so. A library, or a university, could either find you a faucet or steer you to one.

I resent the HELL out of paying $2 for a pint of brand-name water, when traveling. When I'm on the road I always have at least a gallon of drinking water with me.
 
I've been drinking nothing but bottled water for years, and will probably be doing so for a long time. I have bottled water set aside for emergency use.

Paranoid I don't think so, but maybe so.
 
walkingnam said:
I've been drinking nothing but bottled water for years, and will probably be doing so for a long time. I have bottled water set aside for emergency use.

Paranoid I don't think so, but maybe so.
Click to expand...
Not paranoid, so much as...pardon me for saying it...foolish.

If you read the fine print on many bottled-water brands (or it used to be on the print, anyway) you will find that many come out of "municipal water system" of City X, Y or Z. It may be that now they're not so transparent.

Even the true "exotic" brands like Evian (the name is "naivE" spelled backwards) which come from exotic places like France...often are high in lead and other contaminants.

My take: Water is water. They're not making any more; but it's not exactly destroyed, either. There is pure and not-pure. There is nearly pure (properly filtered) and improperly (municipal water with contaminants, too many minerals added, etc.)

For a SHTF moment, I think that what comes out of the tap is pretty-good fine. Or what CAME out of the tap before it got contaminated. Get three or four stackable plastic cubes, fill them off the bathtub faucet; drain/refill them once a month...and you should be good.
 
searcher said:
Are you running a generator for power at your lake house? If you are what kind are you using?
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We are electric on a rural coop ( geothermal heat pump) with whole house propane backup generator. We’ve had to use it only twice so far. The generator (kholer) runs the well pump. I also keep 20 gallons of water on hand for the short outages.
 
I have been drinking water from our deep well for the last 25 years. I have a scenic river as one of my property lines as well as two fresh springs on my property. One feeds two small ponds and the other forms a creek that dumps into the river.

My concern is how I will get water from my well in the case of a long term power outage. I have a Generac and a 500 gallon propane tank buried in the yard, but what happens when the propane runs out?
 
CiscoKid said:
I have been drinking water from our deep well for the last 25 years. I have a scenic river as one of my property lines as well as two fresh springs on my property. One feeds two small ponds and the other forms a creek that dumps into the river.

My concern is how I will get water from my well in the case of a long term power outage. I have a Generac and a 500 gallon propane tank buried in the yard, but what happens when the propane runs out?
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I would look into an old-school windmill.

Direct pumping action. Have a storage tank.
 
Casey Jones said:
I would look into an old-school windmill.

Direct pumping action. Have a storage tank.
Click to expand...

Thanks, but my well pump sits 300 feet down the well. Can a windmill provide that much lift for the water or are you suggesting using the windmill to power a generator to power the well?



Here's why I'm asking. I recently read a book written by Kyle Mills titled "Total Power". It's a continuation of Vince Flynn's Mitch Rapp series. In the book, terrorists sabotage the US power grid and bring the whole country down. And it's not coming back up any time soon. Lots of people panic and die. One of the takeaways I got from the book was that water becomes really scarce when there is no power. Having a well and natural water sources on my property makes me better off than some, but it would sure be nice to be able to get my well water rather than hauling buckets up a hill from one of my springs. I am also looking into one of those hand crank emergency radios.
 
pmbug said:
Have you considered solar power as a backup option for the well/pump?
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Doesn't a well pump take a good amount of amperage? How large would the solar system need to be to reliably power it?


Not saying this wouldn't work - I just don't know much about solar in general. I hear the panels are getting more and more efficient though.
 
I don't know if your current pump would be optimal for a solar power set up or not, but I know that solar powered wells exist, so it's possible.

solartechadvisor.com

How To Run A Well Pump On Solar? The Ultimate Guide | Solartechadvisor

Is your conventional well pump consuming a lot of power and draining big from your grid system as well as your pockets? Here's a cheaper alternative you
solartechadvisor.com
 
Simpler is better.

Solar panels have a service life, relatively short.

Windmills have been known to last a century. Some continue pumping for years after a farm has been abandoned.

I don't think one will lift water 300 feet; but you mentioned you had springs on the land, also. Can you tap into one of those, use a wind pump to pull out more?

Otherwise, your spread will just have a short life before you have to move on...a few years after Year Zero.
 
pmbug said:
I don't know if your current pump would be optimal for a solar power set up or not, but I know that solar powered wells exist, so it's possible.

solartechadvisor.com

How To Run A Well Pump On Solar? The Ultimate Guide | Solartechadvisor

Is your conventional well pump consuming a lot of power and draining big from your grid system as well as your pockets? Here's a cheaper alternative you
solartechadvisor.com
Click to expand...


Thanks for that. I am leaning more towards having the solar array feed batteries and using an inverter to power my well pump through the existing wiring. Seems the least messy course of action and prevents me from having to open up the top of the well (something I would like to avoid). I have a good sized concrete utility room on the south side of my house that is half buried. It measures 12 x 30 and has the washer and dryer at one end, an oil furnace in the middle, and has a water heater and the well pressure tank at the other end. All the wiring going out to the well does so from right behind the pressure tank.

It seems to me that I could place the solar panels at ground level right outside the windows to this room and run the wires from them inside where I could have the batteries. Unless there are safety concerns about having the batteries in the house. The inverter could reside next to the batteries and I could wire the whole thing up to a manual switch that would cut my well off from the house power to the inverter power.

Does any of that sound feasible to you guys?
 
Casey Jones said:
Simpler is better.

Solar panels have a service life, relatively short.

Windmills have been known to last a century. Some continue pumping for years after a farm has been abandoned.

I don't think one will lift water 300 feet; but you mentioned you had springs on the land, also. Can you tap into one of those, use a wind pump to pull out more?

Otherwise, your spread will just have a short life before you have to move on...a few years after Year Zero.
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I've got springs, but they are both way down over the hill towards the river. The thought of trudging all that heavy water up that hill makes my knees ache just thinking about it.

I'm seeing solar panel manufacturers stating 25 years before the panels start to degrade. Now, I'm sure that is a best-case scenario, and that they lose maximum effectiveness much sooner than that, but even 80% would be better than none, right?
 
CiscoKid said:
... Unless there are safety concerns about having the batteries in the house. ...
Click to expand...

Most people think "electric car" when they hear "Tesla", but the company actually is a leading manufacturer of batteries for solar systems. Germane thread discussion on the topic:

teslamotorsclub.com

Powerwall mounted inside or outside?

I'm having solar and the powerwall installed in a couple of weeks and my intention is to have it installed outside. This is what we planned for and I think it will be the best overall location for me. East facing wall and right next to my meter. They told me being outside has no net effect on...
teslamotorsclub.com teslamotorsclub.com

My understanding:

Best - climate controlled environment; not in a living space

OK - outdoors

No go - in a living space

~~~

When I was investigating solar a few years back, I recall (at that time) that the inverter or batteries are more likely to fail/require maintenance before the panels. The panels should last a long time unless you have extreme weather (lots of nasty hail or tornado strength winds).

I'm not an expert on solar tech though. You should call a few solar companies (and/or installers) to get a better idea of what is possible and the potential headaches/pitfalls/maintenance.
 
pmbug said:
Most people think "electric car" when they hear "Tesla", but the company actually is a leading manufacturer of batteries for solar systems. Germane thread discussion on the topic:

teslamotorsclub.com

Powerwall mounted inside or outside?

I'm having solar and the powerwall installed in a couple of weeks and my intention is to have it installed outside. This is what we planned for and I think it will be the best overall location for me. East facing wall and right next to my meter. They told me being outside has no net effect on...
teslamotorsclub.com teslamotorsclub.com

My understanding:

Best - climate controlled environment; not in a living space

OK - outdoors

No go - in a living space

~~~

When I was investigating solar a few years back, I recall (at that time) that the inverter or batteries are more likely to fail/require maintenance before the panels. The panels should last a long time unless you have extreme weather (lots of nasty hail or tornado strength winds).

I'm not an expert on solar tech though. You should call a few solar companies (and/or installers) to get a better idea of what is possible and the potential headaches/pitfalls/maintenance.
Click to expand...

Technically, this laundry room isn't a "living space". It is cinderblock all around and has a poured concrete ceiling, which is one of my porches on the outside of the house. I have another porch off the front of the house that sits about four feet off the ground. Maybe the batteries could be housed under that? They would receive a good deal of protection from the elements there.

Edited to add: After reading that entire article, I saw attached garages being mentioned as being okay for the Powerwalls. I'm thinking my laundry room might be acceptable as the batteries would always be kept between 60 and 70 degrees and protected from the elements.
 
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CiscoKid said:
Technically, this laundry room isn't a "living space". It is cinderblock all around and has a poured concrete ceiling, which is one of my porches on the outside of the house. ...
Click to expand...

The laundry room sounds like it would be ideal, but an installer who can look it over would have a better idea.
 
Definitely glad I mentioned this here. After reading that book, I came away convinced that water and personal security were #1 and #2 on the list. Security isn't much of a problem, but I need to get this water situation resolved. I have 45 acres of critters to shoot for food and a river and ponds to get fish out of. As long as we have water we won't starve.
 
pmbug said:
BTW, see also (if you aren't blocking the ChatGPT forum room):

www.pmbug.com

ChatGPT: - solar power system for a well pump

What are typical maintenance issues for a solar system used to power a well pump? What are the most common points of failure?
www.pmbug.com www.pmbug.com
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Not blocking it, but so far, from what I have seen of it, it is a lot like Kamala Harris.




It fails to impress me. :ROFLMAO:



Seriously though, I've gotten a lot of food for thought now. It all looks doable, provided everything is sized out correctly. Looks like the biggest hurdle is the start-up (surge) amperage required for the 2hp pump. Will definitely be an investment, but I have every confidence that my accountant can write it all off. That's what I pay him for. That diysolar forum has a lot of people with a good deal of knowledge in this stuff. I can learn a great deal there. (y)
 
Regarding pumping, if you have a good flow but the water is below where you want it, ram pumps are a proven way that uses no power, apart from impetus from the flow of the water.
Ive got a couple of these german beauties that will hopefully capture flow from two good springs and lift 10% of it around 80 ft to where it is needed for long term. A bit of filtration, ie sub 5 micron and you should be ok to drink spring water.

And regarding deep well pumping, the old way was to have a long pipe with a foot valve, that moves gently up and down using a simple electric motor positioned at the well head. Those old windmills you sometimes see out in the sticks use this idea.
www.vecteezy.com

Download old windmill on a farm for free

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www.vecteezy.com www.vecteezy.com

Modern submersibles are all very good but they do fail and are expensive to replace ......
 
This post may contain affiliate links for which PM Bug gold and silver discussion forum may be compensated.
No replacing, if TSHTF - EOTWAWKI.

Simpler, better. When something breaks, take it down to someone who runs a crude welding/blacksmithing shop.
 
Here is the absolute simplest, most reliable water supply:

I happen to have two drinking water wells. I have rigged one of them with a removable cap. Stored in my garage is a 16' long, two-inch wide PVC pipe with a plugged bottom end and water entry holes drilled into it near the top.

A 20' yellow rope through the PVC pipe at the top end allows even ladies to take off the cap, lower the pipe by that yellow rope into the well -- allowing it to slowly sink until the yellow rope reaches the T-Bar set in it.

Raise the rope/pipe out and pour the water into a container. You get about a gallon each time of cool, clear drinking water.

Designed reminiscent of a giant French "wine thief" tool.
 
...
According to the Alabama Department of Public Health, an estimated 2.1 million Alabamians depend on groundwater as their primary source of drinking water.

As much as 20 percent of these consumers use private water supplies, such as wells. Because of this, individuals are responsible for guaranteeing the safety of their own drinking water.
...
Click to expand...

www.cnbc.com

These U.S. states have the best and the worst tap water: Kentucky ranked No. 1 while Alabama came in dead last

In June, J.D. Power ranked the states with the best and worst tap water based quality, reliability, conservation and more.
www.cnbc.com www.cnbc.com

That blew my mind. I didn't think any State had that high a percentage of people using private water supplies.
 
They disqualified themselves right off, by throwing in the "climate-crisis" bovine excrement.

Since this dreck is written by Evian-swilling girlie J-School graduates...(and Evian is naivE spelled backwards) I would expect they'd look askance at people who drink tap water - just as they look down at veterans, conservatives, patriots and Alabamans.
 
pmbug said:
That blew my mind. I didn't think any State had that high a percentage of people using private water supplies.
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For my entire life, except for maybe two (or maybe three) years, I use(d) water from a private well.
 
Someone_else said:
For my entire life, except for maybe two (or maybe three) years, I use(d) water from a private well.
Click to expand...
It's better water, if the well-driller and property owner found a good source.

I've had well water several periods in my life. Far less aftertaste - because, of course, nothing added. No stench of chlorine, as you sometimes find with city water. No added minerals to cake up faucet heads.
 
Casey Jones said:
It's better water, if the well-driller and property owner found a good source.

I've had well water several periods in my life. Far less aftertaste - because, of course, nothing added. No stench of chlorine, as you sometimes find with city water. No added minerals to cake up faucet heads.
Click to expand...
If you lived on Long Island, you could tell when someone ran a bath. It smelled up the whole house. Down here in Floriduh, there are some municipalities that have city water. They are the ones that give out "boil water" orders from time to time.

Meanwhile, my well water has no accidental sewage discharge into it like Ft. Liquordale, but then I have a RO rig that gives me better than any bottled water.

Some people have wells from long ago; too shallow, or poorly maintained. That can get dicey. Nuffin's perfect, but experience has shown me well water -- in general -- is the better choice... if you can make a choice.
 
The state tests my well water twice a year for free. I've never had a test come back bad. Three hundred foot well and my property has fresh springs and has a scenic river as one of the property lines. Lots of good water underground.

When I was installing fence down by the ponds, I had to rent a post pounder because when I tried to use the auger, I was hitting the water table at one foot.
 
CiscoKid said:
I am also looking into one of those hand crank emergency radios.
Click to expand...

Not touting this. Read the write up on SWLing blog. Just food for thought.

swling.com

The new Sangean MMR-99 series emergency radio

Many thanks to SWLing Post contributor, Mangosman, who writes: Thomas, I saw the Radio World review of the Sangean MMR-99 (page 16). As I usually do I go to the source which in this case is the San…
swling.com

Edit to add: When I get a chance I'll post some reviews on weather radios (including some of my personal stuff) in the short wave radio thread.
 
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Army Corps of Engineers to barge 36 million gallons of freshwater a day as saltwater intrusion threatens New Orleans-area drinking water​

The US Army Corps of Engineers is planning to barge 36 million gallons of freshwater daily into the lower Mississippi River near New Orleans as saltwater intrusion from the Gulf of Mexico continues to threaten drinking water supply, officials said Friday.

The move comes as water levels are plummeting for the second consecutive year after this summer’s blistering heat and low rainfall triggered extreme drought over parts of the central US.

More:

 

More than 70M Americans have water contaminated with ‘forever chemicals’: study​

More than 70 million Americans are drinking tap water contaminated with “forever chemicals” linked to cancer, as well as reproductive and immune system damage, according to a federal study.

These “forever chemicals” — formally known as per- and poly-fluoroalkyl substances (PFAS) — are microscopic, man-made compounds that can’t be broken down by the body.

The federal Environmental Protection Agency reported this month that after testing just one-third of public water supplies in the US, an alarming number of residents are being exposed to “forever chemicals.”

Of the 3,700 water systems tested by the EPA, the most contaminated were found in densely populated regions like New York, New Jersey, and parts of California and Texas.

The EPA’s results were extrapolated and applied to population figures in an analysis by the activist organization Environment Working Group (EWG), the Daily Mail earlier reported.

More:

 
Went searching for a way to get my well water in the case of a prolonged power outage. I can handle short power outages as I have a Generac and a 500 pound propane tank for it, but I was thinking of a real SHTF scenario. My well is 300 feet deep with the pump sitting at 270 feet. However, there is so much water under my hill that my static water level is between 14 and 17 feet. I look at solar with batteries, but the startup amperage required by the well pump makes this problematic. After a good bit of research, I purchased one of these... https://www.apocalypsewellpumps.com/.


Hope to never have to use it, but feel better knowing that it is on a shelf in the basement if it is ever needed.
 
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